Buthowcanourlawsufficientlytrainthedirectorofeducation。
　　himself；forasyetallhasbeenimperfect，andnothinghasbeensaideitherclearorsatisfactory？Now，asfaraspossible，thelawoughttoleavenothingtohim，buttoexplaineverything，thathemaybeaninterpreterandtutortoothers。Aboutdancesandmusicandchoralstrains，Ihavealreadyspokenbothtothecharacteroftheselectionofthem，andthemannerinwhichtheyaretobeamendedandconsecrated。Butwehavenotasyetspoken，Oillustriousguardianofeducation，ofthemannerinwhichyourpupilsaretousethosestrainswhicharewritteninprose，althoughyouhavebeeninformedwhatmartialstrainstheyaretolearnandpractise；whatrelatesinthefirstplacetothelearningofletters，andsecondly，tothelyre，andalsotocalculation，which，asweweresaying，isneedfulforthemalltolearn，andanyotherthingswhicharerequiredwithaviewtowarandthemanagementofhouseandcity，and，lookingtothesameobject，whatisusefulintherevolutionsoftheheavenlybodies-thestarsandsunandmoon，andthevariousregulationsaboutthesematterswhicharenecessaryforthewholestate-Iamspeakingofthearrangementsof；daysinperiodsofmonths，andofmonthsinyears，whicharetobeobserved，inorderthatseasonsandsacrificesandfestivalsmayhavetheirregularandnaturalorder，andkeepthecityaliveandawake，theGodsreceivingthehonoursduetothem，andmenhavingabetterunderstandingaboutthem：allthesethings，Omyfriend，havenotyetbeensufficientlydeclaredtoyoubythelegislator。Attend，then，towhatIamnowgoingtosay：-Weweretellingyou，inthefirstplace，thatyouwerenotsufficientlyinformedaboutletters，andtheobjectionwastothiseffect-thatyouwerenevertoldwhetherhewhowasmeanttobearespectablecitizenshouldapplyhimselfindetailtothatsortoflearning，ornotapplyhimselfatall；andthesameremarkholdsgoodofthestudyofthelyre。Butnowwesaythatheoughttoattendtothem。A
　　fairtimeforaboyoftenyearsoldtospendinlettersisthreeyears；theageofthirteenisthepropertimeforhimtobegintohandlethelyre，andhemaycontinueatthisforanotherthreeyears，neithermorenorless，andwhetherhisfatherorhimselflikeordislikethestudy，heisnottobeallowedtospendmoreorlesstimeinlearningmusicthanthelawallows。Andlethimwhodisobeysthelawbedeprivedofthoseyouthfulhonoursofwhichweshallhereafterspeak。Hear，however，firstofall，whattheyoungoughttolearnintheearlyyearsoflife，andwhattheirinstructorsoughttoteachthem。Theyoughttobeoccupiedwiththeirlettersuntiltheyaretoreadandwrite；buttheacquisitionofperfectbeautyorquicknessinwritinig，ifnaturehasnotstimulatedthemtoacquiretheseaccomplishmentsinthegivennumberofyears，theyshouldletalone。Andastothelearningofcompositionscommittedtowritingwhicharenotsettothelyre，whethermetricalorwithoutrhythmicaldivisions，compositionsinprose，astheyaretermed，havingnorhythmorharmony-seeinghowdangerousarethewritingshandeddowntousbymanywritersofthisclass-whatwillyoudowiththem，Omostexcellentguardiansofthelaw？orhowcanthelawgiverrightlydirectyouaboutthem？Ibelievethathewillbeingreatdifficulty。
　　Cle。Whattroublesyou，Stranger？andwhyareyousoperplexedinyourmind？
　　Ath。Younaturallyask，Cleinias，andtoyouandMegillus，whoaremypartnersintheworkoflegislation，Imuststatethemoredifficultaswellastheeasierpartsofthetask。
　　Cle。Towhatdoyoureferinthisinstance？
　　Ath。Iwilltellyou。Thereisadifficultyinopposingmanymyriadsofmouths。
　　Cle。Well，andhavewenotalreadyopposedthepopularvoiceinmanyimportantenactments？
　　Ath。Thatisquitetrue；andyoumeantoimply，thattheroadwhichwearetakingmaybedisagreeabletosomebutisagreeabletoasmanyothers，orifnottoasmany，atanyratetopersonsnotinferiortotheothers，andincompanywiththemyoubidme，atwhateverrisk，toproceedalongthepathoflegislationwhichhasopenedoutofourpresentdiscourse，andtobeofgoodcheer，andnottofaint。
　　Cle。Certainly。
　　Ath。AndIdonotfaint；Isay，indeed，thatwehaveagreatmanypoetswritinginhexameter，trimeter，andallsortsofmeasures-somewhoareserious，otherswhoaimonlyatraisingalaugh-andallmankinddeclarethattheyouthwhoarerightlyeducatedshouldbebroughtupinthemandsaturatedwiththem；someinsistthattheyshouldbeconstantlyhearingthemreadaloud，andalwayslearningthem，soastogetbyheartentirepoets；whileothersselectchoicepassagesandlongspeeches，andmakecompendiumsofthem，sayingthattheseoughttobecommittedtomemory，ifamanistobemadegoodandwisebyexperienceandlearningofmanythings。Andyouwantmenowtotellthemplainlyinwhattheyarerightandinwhattheyarewrong。
　　Cle。Yes，Ido。
　　Ath。ButhowcanIinonewordrightlycomprehendallofthem？Iamofopinion，and，ifIamnotmistaken，thereisageneralagreement，thateveryoneofthesepoetshassaidmanythingswellandmanythingsthereverseofwell；andifthisbetrue，thenIdoaffirmthatmuchlearningisdangeroustoyouth。
　　Cle。Howwouldyouadvisetheguardianofthelawtoact？
　　Ath。Inwhatrespect？
　　Cle。Imeantowhatpatternshouldhelookashisguideinpermittingtheyoungtolearnsomethingsandforbiddingthemtolearnothers。Donotshrinkfromanswering。
　　Ath。MygoodCleinias，IratherthinkthatIamfortunate。
　　Cle。Howso？
　　Ath。IthinkthatIamnotwhollyinwantofapattern，forwhenI
　　considerthewordswhichwehavespokenfromearlydawnuntilnow，andwhich，asIbelieve，havebeeninspiredbyHeaven，theyappeartometobequitelikeapoem。WhenIreflecteduponallthesewordsofours。Inaturallyfeltpleasure，forofallthediscourseswhichI
　　haveeverlearntorheard，eitherinpoetryorprose，thisseemedtometobethejustest，andmostsuitableforyoungmentohear；I
　　cannotimagineanybetterpatternthanthiswhichtheguardianofthelawwhoisalsothedirectorofeducationcanhave。Hecannotdobetterthanadvisetheteacherstoteachtheyoungthesewordsandanywhichareofalikenature，ifheshouldhappentofindthem，eitherinpoetryorprose，orifhecomeacrossunwrittendiscoursesakintoours，heshouldcertainlypreservethem，andcommitthemtowriting。And，firstofall，heshallconstraintheteachersthemselvestolearnandapprovethem，andanyofthemwhowillnot，shallnotbeemployedbyhim，butthosewhomhefindsagreeinginhisjudgment，heshallmakeuseofandshallcommittothemtheinstructionandeducationofyouth。Andhereandonthiswiseletmyfancifultaleaboutlettersandteachersofletterscometoanend。
　　Cle。Idonotthink，Stranger，thatwehavewanderedoutoftheproposedlimitsoftheargument；butwhetherwearerightornotinourwholeconception，Icannotbeverycertain。
　　Ath。Thetruth，Cleinias，maybeexpectedtobecomeclearerwhen，aswehaveoftensaid，wearriveattheendofthewholediscussionaboutlaws。
　　Cle。Yes。
　　Ath。Andnowthatwehavedonewiththeteacherofletters，theteacherofthelyrehastoreceiveordersfromus。
　　Cle。Certainly。
　　Ath。Ithinkthatwehaveonlytorecollectourpreviousdiscussions，andweshallbeabletogivesuitableregulationstouchingallthispartofinstructionandeducationtotheteachersofthelyre。
　　Cle。Towhatdoyourefer？
　　Ath。Weweresaying，ifIrememberrightly，thatthesixty-year-oldchoristersofDionysusweretobespeciallyquickintheirperceptionsofrhythmandmusicalcomposition，thattheymightbeabletodistinguishgoodandbadimitation，thatistosay，theimitationofthegoodorbadsoulwhenundertheinfluenceofpassion，rejectingtheoneanddisplayingtheotherinhymnsandsongs，charmingthesoulsofyouth，andinvitingthemtofollowandattainvirtuebythewayofimitation。
　　Cle。Verytrue。
　　Ath。Andwiththisview，theteacherandthelearneroughttousethesoundsofthelyre，becauseitsnotesarepure，theplayerwhoteachesandhispupilrenderingnotefornoteinunison；butcomplexity，andvariationofnotes，whenthestringsgiveonesoundandthepoetorcomposerofthemelodygivesanother-alsowhentheymakeconcordsandharmoniesinwhichlesserandgreaterintervals，slowandquick，orhighandlownotes，arecombined-or，again，whentheymakecomplexvariationsofrhythms，whichtheyadapttothenotesofthelyre-allthatsortofthingisnotsuitedtothosewhohavetoacquireaspeedyandusefulknowledgeofmusicinthreeyears；
　　foroppositeprinciplesareconfusing，andcreateadifficultyinlearning，andouryoungmenshouldlearnquickly，andtheirmerenecessaryacquirementsarenotfewortrifling，aswillbeshowninduecourse。Letthedirectorofeducationattendtotheprinciplesconcerningmusicwhichwearelayingdown。Astothesongsandwordsthemselveswhichthemastersofchorusesaretoteachandthecharacterofthem，theyhavebeenalreadydescribedbyus，andarethesamewhich，whenconsecratedandadaptedtothedifferentfestivals，wesaidweretobenefitcitiesbyaffordingthemaninnocentamusement。
　　Cle。That，again，istrue。
　　Ath。Thenlethimwhohasbeenelectedadirectorofmusicreceivetheserulesfromusascontainingtheverytruth；andmayheprosperinhisoffice!Letusnowproceedtolaydownotherrulesinadditiontotheprecedingaboutdancingandgymnasticexerciseingeneral。Havingsaidwhatremainedtobesaidabouttheteachingofmusic，letusspeakinlikemanneraboutgymnastic。Forboysandgirlsoughttolearntodanceandpractisegymnasticexercises-oughttheynot？
　　Cle。Yes。
　　Ath。Thentheboysoughttohavedancingmasters，andthegirlsdancingmistressestoexercisethem。
　　Cle。Verygood。
　　Ath。Thenoncemoreletussummonhimwhohasthechiefconcerninthebusiness，thesuperintendentofyouth[i。e。，thedirectorofeducation]；hewillhaveplentytodo，ifheistohavethechargeofmusicandgymnastic。
　　Cle。Buthowwilloldmanbeabletoattendtosuchgreatcharges？
　　Ath。Omyfriend，therewillbenodifficulty，forthelawhasalreadygivenandwillgivehimpermissiontoselectashisassistantsinthischargeanycitizens，maleorfemale，whomhedesires；andhewillknowwhomheoughttochoose，andwillbeanxiousnottomakeamistake，fromaduesenseofresponsibility，andfromaconsciousnessoftheimportanceofhisoffice，andalsobecausehewillconsiderthatifyoungmenhavebeenandarewellbroughtup，thenallthingsgoswimmingly，butifnot，itisnotmeettosay，nordowesay，whatwillfollow，lesttheregardersofomensshouldtakealarmaboutourinfantstate。Manythingshavebeensaidbyusaboutdancingandaboutgymnasticmovementsingeneral；forweincludeundergymnasticsallmilitaryexercises，suchasarchery，andallhurlingofweapons，andtheuseofthelightshield，andallfightingwithheavyarms，andmilitaryevolutions，andmovementsofarmies，andencampings，andallthatrelatestohorsemanship。Ofallthesethingsthereoughttobepublicteachers，receivingpayfromthestate，andtheirpupilsshouldbethemenandboysinthestate，andalsothegirlsandwomen，whoaretoknowallthesethings。Whiletheyareyetgirlstheyshouldhavepractiseddancinginarmsandthewholeartoffighting-whengrown-upwomen，theyshouldapplythemselvestoevolutionsandtactics，andthemodeofgroundingandtakinguparms；iffornootherreason，yetincasethewholemilitaryforceshouldhavetoleavethecityandcarryonoperationsofwaroutside，thatthosewhowillhavetoguardtheyoungandtherestofthecitymaybeequaltothetask；and，ontheotherhand，whenenemies，whetherbarbarianorHellenic，comefromwithoutwithmightyforceandmakeaviolentassaultuponthem，andthuscompelthemtofightforthepossessionofthecity，whichisfarfrombeinganimpossibility，greatwouldbethedisgracetothestate，ifthewomenhadbeensomiserablytrainedthattheycouldnotfightfortheiryoung，asbirdswill，againstanycreaturehoweverstrong，anddieorundergoanydanger，butmustinstantlyrushtothetemplesandcrowdatthealtarsandshrines，andbringuponhumannaturethereproach，thatofallanimalsmanisthemostcowardly!
　　Cle。Suchawantofeducation，Stranger，iscertainlyanunseemlythingtohappeninastate，aswellasagreatmisfortune。
　　Ath。Supposethatwecarryourlawtotheextentofsayingthatwomenoughtnottoneglectmilitarymatters，butthatallcitizens，maleandfemalealike，shallattendtothem？
　　Cle。Iquiteagree。
　　Ath。Ofwrestlingwehavespokeninpart，butofwhatIshouldcallthemostimportantpartwehavenotspoken，andcannoteasilyspeakwithoutshowingatthesametimebygestureaswellasinwordwhatwemean；whenwordandactioncombine，andnottillthen，weshallexplainclearlywhathasbeensaid，pointingoutthatofallmovementswrestlingismostakintothemilitaryart，andistobepursuedforthesakeofthis，andnotthisforthesakeofwrestling。
　　Cle。Excellent。