Nowwedonotneedmanyhorses，fortheycannotbeofmuchuseinacountrylikeCrete，andhencewenaturallydonottakegreatpainsabouttherearingofthemorabouthorseraces。Thereisnoonewhokeepsachariotamongus，andanyrivalryinsuchmatterswouldbealtogetheroutofplace；therewouldbenosensenoranyshadowofsenseininstitutingcontestswhicharenotafterthemannerofourcountry。Andthereforewegiveourprizesforsinglehorses-forcoltswhohavenotyetcasttheirteeth，andforthosewhoareintermediate，andforthefull-grownhorsesthemselves；andthusourequestriangameswillaccordwiththenatureofthecountry。Letthemhaveconflictandrivalryinthesemattersinaccordancewiththelaw，andletthecolonelsandgeneralsofhorsedecidetogetheraboutallcoursesandaboutthearmedcompetitorsinthem。Butwehavenothingtosaytotheunarmedeitheringymnasticexercisesorinthesecontests。Ontheotherhand，theCretanbowmanorjavelin-manwhofightsinarmouronhorsebackisuseful，andthereforewemayaswellplaceacompetitionofthissortamongamusements。Womenarenottobeforcedtocompetebylawsandordinances；butiffromprevioustrainingtheyhaveacquiredthehabitandarestrongenoughandliketotakepart，letthemdoso，girlsaswellasboys，andnoblametothem。
　　Thusthecompetitioningymnasticandthemodeoflearningithavebeendescribed；andwehavespokenalsoofthetoilsofthecontest，andofdailyexercisesunderthesuperintendenceofmasters。Likewise，whatrelatestomusichasbeen，forthemostpart，completed。Butastorhapsodesandthelike，andthecontestsofchoruseswhicharetoperformatfeasts，allthisshallbearrangedwhenthemonthsanddaysandyearshavebeenappointedforGodsanddemi-gods，whethereverythirdyear，oragaineveryfifthyear，orinwhateverwayormannertheGodsmayputintomen’smindsthedistributionandorderofthem。Atthesametime，wemayexpectthatthemusicalcontestswillbecelebratedintheirturnbythecommandofthejudgesandthedirectorofeducationandtheguardiansofthelawmeetingtogetherforthispurpose，andthemselvesbecominglegislatorsofthetimesandnatureandconditionsofthechoralcontestsandofdancingingeneral。Whattheyoughtseverallytobeinlanguageandsong，andintheadmixtureofharmonywithrhythmandthedance，hasbeenoftendeclaredbytheoriginallegislator；andhissuccessorsoughttofollowhim，makingthegamesandsacrificesdulytocorrespondatfittingtimes，andappointingpublicfestivals。Itisnotdifficulttodeterminehowtheseandthelikemattersmayhavearegularorder；
　　nor，again，willthealterationofthemdoanygreatgoodorharmtothestate。Thereis，however，anothermatterofgreatimportanceanddifficulty，concerningwhichGodshouldlegislate，iftherewereanypossibilityofobtainingfromhimanordinanceaboutit。Butseeingthatdivineaidisnottobehad，thereappearstobeaneedofsomeboldmanwhospeciallyhonoursplainnessofspeech，andwillsayoutrightwhathethinksbestforthecityandcitizens-ordainingwhatisgoodandconvenientforthewholestateamidthecorruptionsofhumansouls，opposingthemightiestlusts，andhavingnomanhishelperbuthimselfstandingaloneandfollowingreasononly。
　　Cle。Whatisthis，Stranger，thatyouaresaying？Forwedonotasyetunderstandyourmeaning。
　　Ath。Verylikely；Iwillendeavourtoexplainmyselfmoreclearly。
　　WhenIcametothesubjectofeducation，Ibeheldyoungmenandmaidensholdingfriendlyintercoursewithoneanother。Andtherenaturallyaroseinmymindasortofapprehension-Icouldnothelpthinkinghowoneistodealwithacityinwhichyouthsandmaidensarewellnurtured，andhavenothingtodo，andarenotundergoingtheexcessiveandserviletoilswhichextinguishwantonness，andwhoseonlycaresduringtheirwholelifearesacrificesandfestivalsanddances。How，insuchastateasthis，willtheyabstainfromdesireswhichthrustmanyamanandwomanintoperdition；andfromwhichreason，assumingthefunctionsoflaw，commandsthemtoabstain？Theordinancesalreadymademaypossiblygetthebetterofmostofthesedesires；theprohibitionofexcessivewealthisaveryconsiderablegaininthedirectionoftemperance，andthewholeeducationofouryouthimposesalawofmoderationonthem；moreover，theeyeoftherulersisrequiredalwaystowatchovertheyoung，andnevertolosesightofthem；andtheseprovisionsdo，asfarashumanmeanscaneffectanything，exercisearegulatinginfluenceuponthedesiresingeneral。Buthowcanwetakeprecautionsagainsttheunnaturallovesofeithersex，fromwhichinnumerableevilshavecomeuponindividualsandcities？Howshallwedevisearemedyandwayofescapeoutofsogreatadanger？Truly，Cleinias，hereisadifficulty。InmanywaysCreteandLacedaemonfurnishagreathelptothosewhomakepeculiarlaws；butinthematteroflove，aswearealone，Imustconfessthattheyarequiteagainstus。ForifanyonefollowingnatureshouldlaydownthelawwhichexistedbeforethedaysofLaius，anddenouncetheselustsascontrarytonature，adducingtheanimalsasaproofthatsuchunionsweremonstrous，hemightprovehispoint，buthewouldbewhollyatvariancewiththecustomofyourstates。
　　Further，theyarerepugnanttoaprinciplewhichwesaythatalegislatorshouldalwaysobserve；forwearealwaysenquiringwhichofourenactmentstendstovirtueandwhichnot。Andsupposewegrantthattheselovesareaccountedbylawtobehonourable，oratleastnotdisgraceful，inwhatdegreewilltheycontributetovirtue？Willsuchpassionsimplantinthesoulofhimwhoisseducedthehabitofcourage，orinthesouloftheseducertheprincipleoftemperance？
　　Whowilleverbelievethis？-orrather，whowillnotblametheeffeminacyofhimwhoyieldstopleasuresandisunabletoholdoutagainstthem？Willnotallmencensureaswomanlyhimwhoimitatesthewoman？Andwhowouldeverthinkofestablishingsuchapracticebylaw？Certainlynoonewhohadinhismindtheimageoftruelaw。Howcanweprove，thatwhatIamsayingistrue？Hewhowouldrightlyconsiderthesemattersmustseethenatureoffriendshipanddesire，andoftheseso-calledloves，fortheyareoftwokinds，andoutofthetwoarisesathirdkind，havingthesamename；andthissimilarityofnamecausesallthedifficultyandobscurity。
　　Cle。Howisthat？
　　Ath。Dearisthelikeinvirtuetothelike，andtheequaltotheequal；dearalso，thoughunlike，ishewhohasabundancetohimwhoisinwant。Andwheneitherofthesefriendshipsbecomesexcessive，wetermtheexcesslove。
　　Cle。Verytrue。
　　Ath。Thefriendshipwhicharisesfromcontrariesishorribleandcoarse，andhasoftennotieofcommunion；butthatwhich，arisesfromlikenessisgentle，andhasatieofcommunionwhichlaststhroughlife。Astothemixedsortwhichismadeupofthemboth，thereis，firstofall，aindeterminingwhathewhoispossessedbythisthirdlovedesires；moreover，heisdrawndifferentways，andisindoubtbetweenthetwoprinciples；theoneexhortinghimtoenjoythebeautyofyouth，andtheotherforbiddinghim。Fortheoneisaloverofthebody，andhungersafterbeauty，likeripefruit，andwouldfainsatisfyhimselfwithoutanyregardtothecharacterofthebeloved；theotherholdsthedesireofthebodytobeasecondarymatter，andlookingratherthanlovingandwithhissouldesiringthesouloftheotherinabecomingmanner，regardsthesatisfactionofthebodilyloveaswantonness；hereverencesandrespectstemperanceandcourageandmagnanimityandwisdom，andwishestolivechastelywiththechasteobjectofhisaffection。Nowthesortoflovewhichismadeupoftheothertwoisthatwhichwehavedescribedasthethird。Seeingthenthattherearethesethreesortsoflove，oughtthelawtoprohibitandforbidthemalltoexistamongus？Isitnotratherclearthatweshouldwishtohaveinthestatethelovewhichisofvirtueandwhichdesiresthebelovedyouthtobethebestpossible；andtheothertwo，ifpossible，weshouldhinder？Whatdoyousay，friendMegillus？
　　Megillus。Ithink，Stranger，thatyouareperfectlyrightinwhatyouhavebeennowsaying。
　　Ath。Iknewwell，myfriend，thatIshouldobtainyourassent，whichIaccept，andthereforehavenoneedtoanalyseyourcustomanyfurther。Cleiniasshallbeprevailedupontogivemehisassentatsomeothertime。Enoughofthis；andnowletusproceedtothelaws。
　　Meg。Verygood。
　　Ath。UponreflectionIseeawayofimposingthelaw，which，inonerespect，iseasy，but，inanother，isoftheutmostdifficulty。
　　Meg。Whatdoyoumean？
　　Ath。Weareallawarethatmostmen，inspiteoftheirlawlessnatures，areverystrictlyandpreciselyrestrainedfromintercoursewiththefair，andthisisnotatallagainsttheirwill，butentirelywiththeirwill。
　　Meg。Whendoyoumean？
　　Ath。Whenanyonehasabrotherorsisterwhoisfair；andaboutasonordaughterthesameunwrittenlawholds，andisamostperfectsafeguard，sothatnoopenorsecretconnectionevertakesplacebetweenthem。Nordoesthethoughtofsuchathingeverenteratallintothemindsofmostofthem。
　　Meg。Verytrue。
　　Ath。Doesnotalittlewordextinguishallpleasuresofthatsort？
　　Meg。Whatword？
　　Ath。Thedeclarationthattheyareunholy，hatedofGod，andmostinfamous；andisnotthereasonofthisthatnoonehaseversaidtheopposite，buteveryonefromhisearliestchildhoodhasheardmenspeakinginthesamemanneraboutthemalwaysandeverywhere，whetherincomedyorinthegraverlanguageoftragedy？WhenthepoetintroducesonthestageaThyestesoranOedipus，oraMacareushavingsecretintercoursewithhissister，herepresentshim，whenfoundout，readytokillhimselfasthepenaltyofhissin。
　　Meg。Youareveryrightinsayingthattradition，ifnobreathofoppositioneverassailsit，hasamarvellouspower。
　　Ath。AmInotalsorightinsayingthatthelegislatorwhowantstomasteranyofthepassionswhichmastermanmayeasilyknowhowtosubduethem？Hewillconsecratethetraditionoftheirevilcharacteramongall，slavesandfreemen，womenandchildren，throughoutthecity：-thatwillbethesurestfoundationofthelawwhichhecanmake。
　　Meg。Yes；butwillheeversucceedinmakingallmankindusethesamelanguageaboutthem？
　　Ath。Agoodobjection；butwasInotjustnowsayingthatIhadawaytomakemenusenaturalloveandabstainfromunnatural，notintentionallydestroyingtheseedsofhumanincrease，orsowingtheminstonyplaces，inwhichtheywilltakenoroot；andthatIwouldcommandthemtoabstaintoofromanyfemalefieldofincreaseinwhichthatwhichissownisnotlikelytogrow？Nowifalawtothiseffectcouldonlybemadeperpetual，andgainanauthoritysuchasalreadypreventsintercourseofparentsandchildren-suchalaw，extendingtoothersensualdesires，andconqueringthem，wouldbethesourceoftenthousandblessings。For，inthefirstplace，moderationistheappointmentofnature，anddetersmenfromallfrenzyandmadnessoflove，andfromalladulteriesandimmoderateuseofmeatsanddrinks，andmakesthemgoodfriendstotheirownwives。
　　Andinnumerableotherbenefitswouldresultifsuchacouldonlybeenforced。Icanimaginesomelustyyouthwhoisstandingby，andwho，onhearingthisenactment，declaresinscurriloustermsthatwearemakingfoolishandimpossiblelaws，andfillstheworldwithhisoutcry。AndthereforeIsaidthatIknewawayofenactingandperpetuatingsuchalaw，whichwasveryeasyinonerespect，butinanothermostdifficult。Thereisnodifficultyinseeingthatsuchalawispossible，andinwhatway；for，asIwassaying，theordinanceonceconsecratedwouldmasterthesoulof，everyman，andterrifyhimintoobedience。Butmattershavenowcometosuchapassthateventhenthedesiredresultseemsasifitcouldnotbeattained，justasthecontinuanceofanentirestateinthepracticeofcommonmealsisalsodeemedimpossible。Andalthoughthislatterispartlydisprovenbythefactoftheirexistenceamongyou，stilleveninyourcitiesthecommonmealsofwomenwouldberegardedasunnaturalandimpossible。IwasthinkingoftherebelliousnessofthehumanheartwhenIsaidthatthepermanentestablishmentofthesethingsisverydifficult。
　　Meg。Verytrue。